Why is some sodium ascorbate clear and other yellow in H2O?

[ofonorow]

Here is a mystery.

Why is the 'hot' IV/C (sodium ascorbate) yellow? And the "cold" IV/C clear?

I spoke to a Naturopathic Doctor treating her own illness, and she has experienced the difference
between the "hot" (Cathcart-style sodium ascorbate) and the cold form of IV/C. She has been getting
high fevers after the Cathcart-style IV, which she would be happy about, unless there is a problem
with the IV. (I explained what I think I know, that Cathcart's has a significant herx effect, and I just
remembered to tell her to slow the drip or take a "cold" IV at the end to clear her blood).

But she tried sodium ascorbate from wholesale nutrition. She mixes herself, and a) it was cold - no
fever or herx, and b) it was clear?

Why would that be? Any ideas?

[studentroland]

[studentroland]

[studentroland]

[studentroland]

But she tried sodium ascorbate from wholesale nutrition. She mixes herself, and a) it was cold - no fever or herx, and b) it was clear?

Why would that be? Any ideas?

Perhaps Herxheimer-reactions occurr whenever there has accumulated breakdown-products from AA in the liquid being injected, irrespective of if the balance between them gives rise to a colour-change or not...? If one mixes the liquid one-self, or at least injects it prior to any accumulation of breakdown-products due to storage, no Herxheimer-reaction have to occurr because there aint any breakdown-products injected?

[ofonorow]

Thank you for the detailed research studentroland!

Can you summarize your findings?


I think the mystery deepens because I just had another call (and I
believe the person will be posting soon), who is giving himself IV/C and
reported the exact same observations.

This fellow too was using a commercial sodium ascorbate (this time
from Bronson, based on the verbal recommendation of the late Dr.
Cathcart.) It was clear in solution and very mild - no Herxheimer.

He switched to DSM Quali-c sodium ascorbate and it became yellow
and he had the strong Herxheimer like the previous lady naturopath.

Now it is not a reaction to this particular sodium ascorbate - because
the compounding pharmacy we use and recommend uses Chinese vitamin C
and has the yellow color and the strong Herx reaction.

My question is why these commercial brands of sodium ascorbate remain
clear in water? The caller had an idea. He said the Bronson sodium ascorbate
did not dissolve, and much remained at the bottom. He said it was coarser,
crystals, did not dissolve well, and the solution remained clear.

The Quali-C (DSM) what we call Cathcart's in honor of the late Dr. Robert
Cathcart, disolved almost instantly - and turned yellow. (I asked this person
to check the pH of both solutions), but I now suspect that the granularity,
the particle size of the powder has something to do with this mystery?

[studentroland]

[studentroland]

[Johnwen]

[studentroland]

[Johnwen]

[studentroland]

[studentroland]

The two glasses I put in the window...? Today Saturday, in the first one with ordinary tapwater in it, the water has evaporated, leaving a small distinctly yellow residue on the bottom with several small circular mold-colonies upon it...In the other glass with distilled water, there is still some water left, and it is starting to attain a slight yellow hue...
Fast-forward to Monday, and now the distilled water has evaporated a great deal aswell, and the remaining small amount of water is definetely clearly yellow...my "gutfeeling" tells me that the yellow colour comes from dehydroascorbic acid, since the yellow hue resembles the colour from the wikipedia site about 1-4-benzoquinone...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1,4-Benzoquinone

[studentroland]

There was an interesting difference in the residues formed from ordinary tapwater and distilled water...the distilled water-residue was more deep yellow, bordering on orange and without any "crystallisations" or what seems as small mold-growths on the residue from the ordinary tap-water-solution...the distilled-water residue consists more of small trapped bubbles, almost like a dried-up orange foam...


Both glasses seen from side...ordinary tapwater-solution-residue to the left, distilled water-solution-residue to the right...

Ordinary tapwater-solution-residue seen from top...

Distilled water-solution-residue seen from top

[studentroland]

This last glass had a somewhat "drawn-out" process, in that after the distilled water had evaporated, the remaining now clearly orange-coloured residue seems to undergo some kind of gas-releasing-process, since the small bubbles initially trapped in the residu slowly gets more, so that the remaining residue very slowly kind-of "swells" a little...the surface is not wet, put forms a kind of "skin", under which the bubbles are trapped...the other glass, with ordinary tap-water is solid white/slightly yellow crystals in the bottom...big difference...so...obviously the constituents of the solvent has impact on the solution, but not necessarily on the colour, since the Na-Ascorbate solution in distilled water after some days turned both yellow and increasingly orange as time went by, and somehow in the process releases some gas which becomes trapped aswell...?